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Refrigerant charge

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  • #16
    The OEM user for the nippondenso is Kubota if that helps.


    • #17
      I have no listing of an SD 505 which would be a 5 cyl 5cid compressor according to Sanden's numbering system, the smallest I show is an SD508
      edit, I did find a 505, only one, Sanden 9056 so they did make one, again a compact compressor.
      Last edited by Cornbinder89; 05-20-2017, 02:04 PM. Reason: More info


      • #18
        Are you happy with how it's mounted and alignment of the belt? Advise if wrong but don't we have reason to believe this compressor is OK? I wouldn't necessarily make a change unless you find something wrong in hand.

        Not mentioned yet is PAG oils (any) are hygroscopic meaning the oil absorbs moisture. Unfortunately if system was left open despite being working just out of the way and not plugged off and let just be back on without a vacuum and some refrigerant even if disabled the oil goes acidic and can eat metal parts from the inside out.

        #1. I've never seen that in person nor at the archived site did we figure any way to know for sure moisture is or even can be removed for either desiccant or oils and no convincing known way to do that.

        I say vacuum and let it sit in full vacuum (turn the pump off) and let it sit for two days. Run engine for some heat now and then and run vacuum if it creeps up at all but really should stay put indefinitely but I blame some on just hoses on gauges if that long.

        Sorry just a thought ahead on getting this to both work and last as long as possible,
        MetroWest, Boston


        • #19
          As far as I know, this compressor was working before the system was evacuated.

          So to try to achieve the correct amount of refrigerant, should I fill the system until I see a certain psi reading on the low side?


          • #20
            OK - Perhaps missed something so if you wish to charge system go for it. Here's a GREAT link I'll find from the site up top that says archives only you too can search for info and procedures. Warning - Lots to read here now.

            Before that vacuum again to know it's holding. IDK what you will be using for but you want vacuum to 29.92Hg at sea level can adjust 1 Hg less per 1,000 ft. of elevation and it really should hold once achieved (pump can be off and put back on when it's maxed some take a couple tries - stop and ask if it will not hold. I'll base suggestion on that you are using a gauge set to vacuum pump and tell me/us if thru 12oz small can(s) or a 30lb can you want a scale to watch, do math for weight discharged.

            It should be 80F or so for best results. Have a thermos ready in center vent inside car and an real good idea of temps in front of radiator as the temp that are meaningful not just a forecast temp. Can be much hotter over pavement and in sun than you think.

            ********* let's see if I can find the links in this case and bear with me this format is new to me also after many years of the same where this forum is really from.

            Charging procedures: Link > http://aircondition.com/tech/questio...ing-Procedures < just about print that out when you can and really read it. Any links within that are probably down just read thru it's long and could be longer.

            * Priority ONE. Keep air out! From a vacuum with and knowing your equipment have both hoses attached and both knobs open for a while then shut just red high side one finish vacuum thru blue or low side hose.

            * All this, engine off. When ready I like to charge what system will take from pressure in source into the vacuum with tank or cans warm not left cool or cold. Now both knobs shut you are reading vacuum. Switch yellow hose to source refrigerant from vacuum pump keeping all air out possible for that switch. Open using liquid into high side till it quits taking more. Low side gauge will show the pressure rise and stop at the static pressure of the temperature of the time when you are doing this. Know how much went in and shut both knobs.

            * Start engine and turn on A/C full blast, full blower fan.

            * With just this the system should have enough pressure to run and may cycle not knowing controls to shut it down or just stay running.

            !! Feel for any heat at high side line off compressor's high and again cool on low side. Quick now see temp at center vent.

            * Open blue knob to low side, gas only meaning can up for 10 seconds or so at a time, shut knobs and look for the reading and observe temps at vent again.

            When it's blowing cool air not perfect now take you time. Rev engine listen to compressor and if any problems probably should just stop everything and note what was done so far and report that and we'll brain storm some ideas. MAKE NOTES ON WHAT IS IN THE SYSTEM.

            It's OK to just stop and disable compressor at this point and ask questions for any problems or pressures not consistent with the procedure link - ASK!

            It that links do not work or anything not understood or different equipment than I think you would be using ask before you even begin.

            MetroWest, Boston


            • #21
              If the link doesn't work I've edited and copied it to another site should show if full script here................

              (Note: This post is a work in progress to have links enabled as we can. This is as concise as this ever so important procedure can be. Credit to my friend "Nacho" of Hermosillo, Sonora, MEXICO)

              Tom Greenleaf

              Links - if they are down here. If more help needed visit us at....

              Basic Charging Procedures:


              We recommend reading this procedure completely before charging. You may need information before charging you want to keep handy. Have this procedure with you while charging. Although it can be done by a single person, we recommend having a helper around.

              This procedure outlines the steps to perform a complete charge. These steps are not to be used to refill or make partial charges. Toping off requires system parameters monitoring and knowledge, specially in R134a-based system. Excessive gas will harm your system and will keep it from cooling properly. MORE REFRIGERANT DOES NOT MEAN COLDER TEMPERATURES

              CHARGING IN GAS OR LIQUID - Please read step 10

              Do not use the sightglass (if so equipped) in R134a-based systems as if were R-12 based.


              1) Vacuum pump

              2) Gauges (R12 or R134a)

              3) Service port adapter (as required in most R12-based systems) R134a systems do not require adapters other than the couplers in your gauges in the majority of applications

              4) Refrigerant gas (R12 or R134a)

              5) Optional: 2-3 ounces of specified oil.


              1. Make sure what is the required amount of gas. From factory, all systems have a decal under the hood that give the data. If the decal is missing or you are not sure, please specify make, model, and the type of refrigerant used and whether your system is a factory or an after market unit. It is very important to know if your system has oil. Oil starvation is the main reason of compressor failure. Oil can be added to the system in two ways: with oil injectors or through the low side port under vacuum. The procedure to add oil through vacuum is described. Some refrigerant charge and other useful specifications are provided
              2. Connect both blue and red gauge hoses to the system's service ports. The discharge port (red hose) is located somewhere between the compressor and expansion device, either before the condenser or after it. In R134a systems, the port is the thicker of both, while in R12 systems is the thinner one. In some aftermarket systems, the port is located in the back of the compressor. If your ports are located in the compressor, the low side is marked by an "S" and the high side by an "H". Port caps have an "L" for low or "H" for high.
              3. Open both gauge valves. Connect the common hose (yellow one) to the vacuum pump. Make sure both gauge needles are zeroed down. Needle is adjusted by turning a fine screw inside the dial. You must remove the plastic lens to do this.
              4. Turn the pump on. You'll notice that both gauge readings begin to drop. The blue gauge's needle will even dip into negative values. The desired low side reading should be less than -25, while the high side will remain at 0.
              5. After approximately 5 minutes, close both gauge valves. Turn the pump off, and observe the needles. Any movement will indicate vacuum loss. The faster the movement, the greater the loss. If after two minutes you don't see any needle movement, open both valves, turn the pump on, and continue vacuum for not less than 30 minutes. Close both valves then turn the pump off.
              6. Get ready to charge. Have the necessary refrigerant amount handy. Cans make charging easier and more precise unless you have a charging cylinder or a precision scale.
              7. Disconnect the yellow hose from the vacuum pump and connect it to the can tap or charging cylinder valve. You can charge in two ways: liquid (can upside down) or gas. Liquid charging is a lot faster but not recommended unless you extreme care or have experience. Traditional (gas) charging is slower but safer.
              8. Once you've decided, and with the can or container connected, unscrew the top yellow hose connection (at the gauges) allowing refrigerant to escape for a couple of seconds. This will purge the air out of the hoses so you make sure that all you dispense is refrigerant. You can do this venting in liquid form so you can see when a fine, steady stream of refrigerant escapes indicating that all the air is gone from the hose. Don't breathe refrigerant and don't charge in a flammable environment.
              9. "Flood" the system with liquid refrigerant (can upside down) by opening the red valve (high side) until it won't take anymore. Close the red valve. Jump the low pressure cycling switch (if so equipped). If you don't know what this is or where it is, ask for help.
              10. Turn the engine on. Turn the A/C into MAX on its third or higher blower speed. You'll note that both gauge readings are now positive. The red gauge should read between 100 and 150, while the blue gauge between 5 and 15. If you are charging with cans, don't forget to purge air out the hose after hooking a new can as described in step 8 above. Now, charge will continue through the low (blue) side (see note below) . If you haven't jumpered any switch (you don't have to), you'll notice the compressor cycling frequently on and off. That is normal. The cycling will disappear as you dispense more refrigerant. The only disadvantage of frequent compressor cycling is that charge will take longer. Needles will move up and down with every cycle. This is normal. Do not jump any switch unless you are absolutely certain!.

              WARNING: DANGER

              NEVER OPEN THE RED VALVE WHILE CHARGING. The red valve is to be opened only during pre-charge, vacuum, or when a system is evacuated. Its function is keeping an eye on the high side only. It must be closed at all times. If you have any doubts, wait until you receive information. Severe injury or death may occur. Remember: ALWAYS wear safety goggles. NEVER charge your system in a closed environment.

              There are two ways to charge: gas (can or cylinder up), or liquid (can or cylinder upside down). A compressor is designed to compress gas. Direct liquid charge will harm the compressor if suction pressure is not controlled. Liquid charging is faster, yet is riskier. Liquid charging should be made by professionals or under supervision. Liquid charging can be done if the suction port is away from the compressor (some compressors have the suction valve in its body).
              Liquid charging can be done never exceeding a 50 PSI suction pressure. If you can't control it, charge in gas form. In cooler weather, cans may freeze. You may immerse them in water and shake them while charging.
              11. Once about 2/3 of the charge has been dispensed into the system, spray water in the condenser to optimize heat exchange and speed the process. When you get the condenser wet, vent temperature is likely to raise. This is normal. You'll also note pressure drop in both gauges.
              12. Once the specified amount has been dispensed, close the blue valve. Let the system run for a minute. Turn the A/C off and then the engine. Wait another minute and disconnect the couplers from the service ports. Disconnect the low side first. If you jumpered a switch, reconnect it too.
              Optimum cooling performance is attained after 10 minutes of operation. Our own acceptance criteria is at least 50°F in the center vent to the driver side at idle after 10 minutes or less. Remember: cooling increases while the vehicle is in motion.

              VERY IMPORTANT

              Due to the physical properties and chemical composition, R134a and R12 charging amounts are different. Never, if you are retrofitting, charge the same or specified amount of R12 with R134a. If in doubt, please e-mail us. Do not use this procedure if you are using any other refrigerant. This is just for R12 or R134a. Although procedures and parameters may be similar, we do not use nor recommend alternative refrigerants.

              Every vehicle has its own operation parameters specification. Depending on whether or not the vehicle has a factory or an after market system, and whether it was retrofitted or is still original, among others. There is no established calculation to determine the exact operating pressures.
              The low pressure (blue gauge) should be 35 or less at idle, regardless of the type of gas. Only if you're running a dual system, the low pressure may be between 45 and 50 at idle.
              The high pressure, for starters, is directly related to ambient temperature: the higher the temperature, the higher the higher the pressure.
              Bear in mind that dispensing a complete charge without lowering the pressures with water will result in higher readings. This is normal, and that is why you should spray water in the condenser at 2/3rds of the charge or once you have completed it. You'll note an immediate pressure drop when you spray water in the condenser.
              To obtain a ballpark high side value, multiply ambient temperature by 2.2 if you have an R12 system. If you have a factory R134a system, use 2.3. To convert °C to °F, use this formula: °C X 1.8 + 32.
              Remember: this is only a ballpark. If in doubt, we have factory charts to help you determine the correct pressures. Please have your vehicle's make, model, refrigerant type, and year and.
              Factors like a an obstructed or very dirty radiator and condenser, weak or inoperative fan clutch, weak or inoperative radiator fan(s), either electric or mechanical, will make pressures go up and impair cooling, even in mild days.

              Great thanks to my good friend Nacho,


              MetroWest, Boston